3.37 We’re Back and Chronically Online
Episode Notes
WELCOME BACK! It’s been five years since the last episode, and a lot has changed — Jess is now a certified and diploma-holding psychological astrologer with a full-time practice, and there’s a brand new co-host in the mix: archetypal astrologer Kate Kettelkamp of Kronos Astrology.
In this episode we introduce ourselves and cover Leo Season, Mercury Retrograde, recent major outer planet ingresses, Love Island, Labubu, Dubai chocolate, matcha, and Natalie Portman McRib.
Book a reading or learn more:
Jess Abbott [Inkblot Astrology]
Kate Kettelkamp [Kronos Astrology]
Support + Subscribe:
Patreon [Inkblot Astrology]
Sign up for our newsletters:
Jess’s Newsletter
Kate’s Newsletter
Follow us:
Instagram
@inkblot_astro
@kronosastrology
Tiktok
@inkblotastrology
@kronosastrology
Episode Transcription
Jess: (00:29.486)
Hello, welcome back to Inkblot astrology for the first time in like, I think five years maybe, I think since 2020. It's a very exciting return because I'm joined by my new friend, fellow astrologer, Kate Kettelkamp of Kronos Astrology. I just, you know, had been thinking about Inkblot in its first iteration with Chris Farren. It was very like funny and light — and then rebranded as Inkblot and it was maybe a little too serious and very lonesome with the mic. I had been, for the last like few years, I'd been thinking it would be really nice to do this with another astrologer and have some back and forth instead of having guests on. And then yeah, Kate and I met and I was like, you know what? This just feels like the right thing. So, hi Kate, how are you today?
Kate:
Hi, everyone! Hi Jess, thanks for having me.
Jess:
Kate's based in Denver and I am now based in Maine. I was in Los Angeles last time I was making this podcast. So we're now on opposite sides of the country. Yeah, I guess I'm going to give myself a little intro because a lot has changed about me as an astrologer since I was making this podcast five years ago. And then we'll hear a little bit about Kate too. All right, so I am Jess Abbott, if this is your first time listening to the show. I live in Kittery, Maine, where I run my astrological practice, Inkblot Astrology. I've been studying astrology since 2014 and working with clients professionally since 2020. I practice psychological astrology through a Jungian lens and I use the Campanus house system. I'm certified by the Center for Psychological Astrology, founded by Liz Green, and I hold a diploma from the Mercury Internet School of Psychological Astrology. I've also studied the history of astrology with Demetra George at Astrology University and studied privately through AFAN, the Association for Astrological Networking's mentorship program, where I was mentored by Lori Barnes under the guidance of Alicia Yusuf. And I'm a member of the Association of Professional Astrologers International, APAI. I'm a former astrology contributor at Hooligan Mag and I started this podcast back in 2019. Okay. Let's hear about you, Kate.
Kate:
Yeah, hello everyone. I am Kate Kettlekamp. I live in Denver, Colorado, and I have my practice here, Kronos Astrology. I study at the California Institute of Integral Studies, currently a PhD student in consciousness studies and specifically interested in archetypal astrology and really align with Jess in that way. I come from the tradition of Rick Tarnas and Becca Tarnas who are both my teachers and I'm really focused on astrology as a lens of viewing the world to strengthen our ways of creating our own narratives, developing personal agency and a way of liberation. I am currently working on a dissertation on psychedelic integration using astrology and interested in peak experiences and the way that we can use the archetypes to integrate.
Jess: (03:57.902)
Amazing and such a cool dissertation topic that I would never think about, but that makes so much sense when you describe it. It's very cool. And I feel like we both have serious ways of utilizing astrology. Neither of us seems to have lot of astrological whimsy or whatever. It doesn't feel super social for us as much as it's a tool and a practice. But then when we get together and talk as we've done, like not in front of a microphone, we're just super like air sign-y and like all over the place and goofy. So I'm really excited to see how this podcast comes together with both of us.
Kate:
I'm very excited to join forces as air signs and the Gemini-Libra combo. I'm excited to see what comes out of that.
Jess:
I'm a Gemini Sun and Kate's a Libra Sun. And I feel like I, I mean, I guess this is very Geminian, but I also have a Pisces Moon and they square each other. So I feel like there's always this like push and pull in myself at all times of like, joke around, be serious, joke around, be serious.
Kate:
Yeah, and then obviously I have the the Libran scales so hopefully we can bring a little bit of both to the podcast.
Jess: (05:22.606)
Yeah. And so we actually haven't known each other that long. We met like, guess, was your reading in May? Sounds right. And we're recording this July 22nd, 2025. It's the first day of Leo season this year. So a couple months ago, we met when Kate booked a reading with me at Inkblot Astrology and in like the booking you had said that you were an astrologer. And I was like, I always get so stressed out. Like I've only given a reading to like a couple other astrologers, but when it happens, I'm like, oh God, I'm always like, they're coming to judge me, which is like, obviously is not what's happening at all. Like astrologers seek other astrologers to get readings with so they can have their chart looked at without bias. And I do it too. But I still get so stressed that I'm like, have to like really bring my A game. And then we met and you were just like, it was so easy to read your chart with you and to talk and hang out. And I don't really have a lot of astrologer friends. I feel like I just, I don't know. I haven't really met many in person, and so I'm always kind of on the lookout for astrologer friends. And after your reading, I was like, would you want to like, chat like talk shop after this and you were so game and then you told me that you heard of me through ChatGPT which also is crazy. I guess this is feeling very Uranus in Gemini how this is all coming together.
Kate:
Shout out chat GPT. Totally. Yeah. So you were a super curated recommendation to me through artificial intelligence. Because I was like, hey, I want an astrologer, specifically someone who's more psychological, archetypal, views the chart through that lens. So on ChatGPT, you were the first recommendation. I booked and, you know. Artificial intelligence nailed it. I was like, yes, this is exactly the kind of astrology that I have a deep appreciation and reverence for. And yeah, super happy that we connected.
Jess:
Yeah, it really feels like the second we then hung out on zoom like a few weeks later, we just like yapped the whole time without even like, yeah, and like half of it was about astrology and half of it wasn't. And I was like, I should give it a few times of hanging out before we lock in the idea of doing a pod like reviving my podcast. But then by the end of it, I was like, No, this is just perfect. It feels very serendipitous.
Kate:
For sure.
Jess:
Well, so we're still, I think we're going to be kind of like feeling out where we want to go with this. This is the first ep together. And what we've talked about so far is kind of maybe just doing a couple, doing like talk, we'll talk about the forecast for the next couple of weeks where our goal is to do an episode every couple of weeks and we'll see if we can stick to that. And so we can talk about the astrological weather for the next couple weeks and then maybe just chat about what's going on in the world and sometimes it'll be astrological and sometimes not. So yeah, you want to jump into forecast stuff?
Kate: (08:53.297)
Let's do it.
Jess:
Yeah, as I mentioned today is the first day of Leo season and it is, so the Sun is opposite Pluto right now. And Pluto in Aquarius, which it entered back in November, right? Is that when it like settled in Aquarius?
Kate:
November.
Jess:
And it hasn't been in Aquarius for forever as we know. So it's like, there's just been so many outer planet shifts this year. It's, think all astrologers have just been like freaking out about it for the like last year leading up to now, right? With Pluto going into Aquarius, Neptune just went into Aries, and then Uranus just went into Gemini. So it kind of was like a six-month span of time where everything, all of these really slow-moving outer planets that spend seven to like 200-something years in signs all just like changed at the same time, which doesn't really happen. So everyone's feeling like this is… that the astrology would suggest this is a really big time for like cultural and global shift. And I feel like you don't even need astrology to make you feel that way right now. It feels like everything is absolutely insane in the world right now.
Kate:
Yeah, definitely. Earlier this year, or maybe last year, I was sharing some astrological predictions with people of this big vibe change happening. And I remember feeling very disappointed that they were like, yeah, I mean, yeah, that's exactly what's happening globally. You don't need astrology to tell you that. So, yeah, definitely nailed it with the cultural and global shifts that we're in the midst of.
Jess:
Yeah. And so like, it's interesting that this Leo season, so technically like Pluto had like peeked in on Aquarius for a second during Leo season last year. So the Sun did oppose Pluto in Aquarius last Leo season for a little bit. So this is technically the second year of it, even though it feels like the first, because it's the first year Pluto has been like settled in Aquarius. Some Pluto oppositions are like, in terms of like the quicker moving like mundane transits I just it always like jumps out to me like ‘oh, we're starting out this Leo season with a Pluto opposition to the Sun’. And then like Mercury's in retrograde for the next few weeks as well. So it feels like you know.. And I think globally, at least in the United States, like nationally looking at all the like Trump-Epstein stuff that's happening right now.. Definitely feels very like, Sun opposite Pluto to kick off Leo season this year. And then you know the opposition goes away after, depending on your orb like the first 10 days of Leo season or whatever is how I would look at it I guess.
Kate:
Right, yeah, I mean, it's kind of exciting to me to think about getting Sun-Pluto for like the next like, I guess like 19 years or so, and that being just something that we return to every year. And just, you know, to touch on the archetypes of the Sun and Pluto — for Sun, you know, the self, the ego, identity, creative pursuits, purpose, and then in terms, because we're looking at a collective transit, the Sun for the collective, it could be a collective sense of self, collective identity, I don't know, anything you would add to that, Jess?
Jess:
Yeah, like the Sun being, I mean, just, I guess, not that I think this is all about Trump Epstein, but just using that as like a big example of something that's happening right now — like the idea of like the people definitely pushing back against the current administration about the release of those Epstein files. Like it feels like the first thing that the left and the right have come together on in like forever.. is like everybody wants to have these Epstein files released. And so we're all kind of like pitted or we're joined up together to be pitted against the administration to try to get the release of those files. And it's like, the only reason those files are being held right now is basically because of like who has power. So we're really seeing the idea of Pluto as like power and who's holding it going against the collective and the people being the Sun in this situation.
Kate: (13:24.056)
Totally, yeah. I think it does. It really is so Plutonic. Like, I don't think it's a stretch there to say the demand to release these files is like Pluto, which is the underworld and what's hidden and secretive and covered up. And so to have this like big push, Mercury also retrograde, you know, the past is coming up. I mean... I don't know if you have any predictions on timing with this retrograde, but I would be shocked if that wasn't prime news space for the next couple weeks.
Jess:
Yeah, for sure. I think like the retrograde too, like coinciding with like, I don't think that the files will be released or that anything kind of like big will change in the administration over the next few weeks. I think it's all just going to be about like the regurgitation of information and like the processing of new information, especially because I think I read something this morning and who knows, like everything changes like every five seconds now. But I read that like the vote that will go to the floor that will potentially most impact the release of these files wouldn't happen until like September or something, which would kind of like back up the idea that with Mercury in retrograde, the information isn't gonna come out yet. It's more just gonna be like processed at this time.
Kate:
Right. Which really does track with retrograde. And I'm curious too, you know, this is a very specific example of how we see the Sun-Pluto playing out on a collective level, especially for the United States. But I'm curious if you have thoughts on, you know, just general themes of that dynamic or what that might mean for us as a country. Or just in general with Sun-Pluto of what you feel to be happening collectively.
Jess:
Collectively, yeah. I mean, Pluto is just so much about power and like big transformations, but this is like because we're looking at it as like through a Leo.. or, you’re talking about the Sun-Pluto specifically, right? That opposition. It's like gonna be so short, but like maybe it plants seeds of like, greater Pluto in Aquarius themes that will happen over the 20 years. Like these are like the Leo Sun seeds being planted in Aquarius-Pluto. And so yeah, I guess like identity comes into that too. I think like political identity has been something big that's been shifting. Like even with like Elon Musk talking about, what is it called? Like the America party or something that he talked about starting a few weeks ago. I don't know, like, I don't know like enough about politics or even Elon Musk to like have any like opinions on how that will go or if it will even happen but like I did think it was really interesting to consider like the fracturing of I guess of the right but it doesn't really matter to me what side would be fractured but just the idea that there's MAGA but then there's so many people on the right that only subscribe to like so much of what the MAGA stuff does and some that don't. And so Elon Musk could really appeal to a lot of people. And like, I just think that there's a lot of division happening with specific issues because everything is so chaotic right now that it would be.. like a single person would be hard pressed to find a politician that fully represents their beliefs. And I think right now like Epstein is really that whole situation is really fracturing MAGA. So the idea that we could go all these different directions on the right and I mean, the left is such a mess right now. It's such a dumpster fire that they're like, honestly, I feel like the right is closer to having more options for them with Elon Musk saying that than the left is, where there's like no one suggesting we start anything new or cool. It was cool to see somebody suggest a new party. I'm always a fan of that no matter who it is or what they're saying really, just to get us away from a two party system.
Kate: (17:32.876)
Right? Yeah, it's interesting to hear you say like, you don't feel like you know enough to talk about politics because it seems like the people who are running the country could say the same thing. So I feel like we're on an equal playing field there. But yeah, I mean, I think that just very basically with the Leo Aquarius, a lot of astrologers have predicted kind of an overthrow of current systems of government. So like the two party system would be something that, you know, you could argue has been designed to like keep this kind of Leo like traditional, like almost like, like the king-like position of the president and of the government. And then Aquarius is associated with Prometheus and power to the people and stealing fire from the gods, bringing it to the people, which does strike me as something that like Leo is almost trying to protect. So with the specific narrative of the Epstein files coming up with Sun-Pluto, I mean, I feel like that could be like a pre-echo of, you know, things to come with, you know, this questioning of the government, which, you know, obviously everyone has been the last like four or five years, like more than that, questioning, you know, is this working for us? And there's been enough, I think levels of, of delusion or confusion kind of more Neptune type archetype of, you know, like, even if it's not, like, what could we do? And now with Neptune moving into alignment with Saturn, I wonder if Saturn too is also clarifying some of those Neptunian questions that we've had over the last few years. I know some people have said that Saturn-Neptune would increase confusion, but I would also be curious in ways in which that Saturn and Neptune coming together cuts through confusion to bring a sense of reality of, you know, this is what's happening in our country. And like we've allowed it to happen. And part of the new Leo-Aquarius axis activation, which will have eclipses, you know, after we get done with the Virgo and Pisces, is really going to be a challenge to the current system of government.
Jess:
Absolutely. And like with Saturn, Neptune being in Aries together right now too, I think like, you know, the idea of confusion could absolutely be heightened if we were looking at them in Pisces together right now or something like that. But I think with Aries, like, it's not that Aries is like the big problem solver of the zodiac or anything, but it is, you know, full of energy and it's not going to be caught sitting on its hands and it wants to keep moving onward. So even if that means moving onward through a bunch more confusion, it's at least kind of like, but it's still moving through it. It's not like sitting in it and sitting in the confusion. So yeah, I think you're totally right. I totally agree that. Yeah, it'll be curious. It'd be interesting to see how like we can kind of get out of some confusion we've had collectively.
Kate:
Yeah. Well, and I believe the, um, where Saturn and Neptune are conjuncting is like the early, like zero one degree of Aries, um, which Austin Coppock calls the hammer. Um, and it's related to individuation. So if we're putting that on a collective level too of individuation of people from the current system of government I think would be a fair take.
Jess:
Totally. And also, since you brought up Austin Coppock and like a specific degree, have you heard how he's like, he's working on a book about the decans?
Kate:
Yeah, I'm patiently waiting for that.
Jess:
I'm pretty excited. haven't done like very much research into decans or anything. Like I'm aware of the decans and this and that. I've read a couple books on them, but I've never been like fully pulled into like utilizing them as much as I could. And I'm really, I feel like if anything's going to, it would be Austin Coppock's book on the decans. So yeah, I'm also like really looking forward to it.
Kate:
For sure.
Jess: (22:12.422)
And also maybe we should, this is going to be part of it too is like, when do we need to explain what the fuck we're talking about? Like in case someone's listening and doesn't know what decans are. Maybe I'll give.. you're going to know more about it than me, I think. So I'm going to say what I think decans are and then you can clean up the mess I make. Alright, decans. So like every sign has three decans right? The first 10 degrees of the sign is a decan, degrees 10 through 20 is a decan and then 20 up to the end, is a decan, right? And then each decan of each sign is said to have different associations and you can break it down even by specific degrees, right? And like a certain degree of a sign can have a particular archetype attached to it or something right? Okay, that's where I want to stop. That's all I know.
Kate:
Yeah, no, I think that nails it. I don't use decans in my own practice unless there's a specific planet or placement that someone is really obsessed with. Because I do think it's just such a fine tuning and the imagery is what I really like. I do think that there's a really strong connection to the tarot and the way that images can really speak. So I think that that also fits in with what we do as more psychological astrologers is using images, which also psychologically the idea of using images, I always think of Jungian psychology and I believe that Jung thought that the only way that the unconscious or the subconscious could communicate was through images. And so the spirit realm, you know, and I think in felt experiences feels true to me. It doesn't communicate through words, but through dreams and through animals and spirits and images. And that's one thing that we can do with astrology is really give archetypal images to phenomenon. And I think that, you know, that would be that this is my, like, I guess, promotion of the decans to myself and other astrologers. You know, it can be very helpful to bring more images into your practice, because I think that we also can become habituated with certain images for certain planets and the decans just like open up like a whole new ballpark of images.
Jess:
Totally. And like even with my practice being called, and this podcast being called Inkblot Astrology, it's like I've, I'm yeah, of course, as a somewhat Jungian astrologer as well, the idea of what you're looking at in a chart is it's like what you see in it, what you feel in it, what resonates with you in a way that's not just like a cookbook definition of something specific in your chart, but like something that like speaks to you on like a sort of like an image level, I guess. So totally. I agree with all of that. I mean images are really strong to the human psyche even if we like step away from the philosophical side of things if you even just look at the human brain at a base level, we've carried these fears of like things like spiders or cockroaches that you know it has said that we have this like instinctual reaction of like horror to these things. They say, right, that it's because cockroaches used to be like fucking massive or something, right? And so we have it like deep in our psyche and like totally out of our control that like we see these certain things and we're like, that's fucking scary. Even if it's not anymore in the present day, just like the images, like we have such strong, imagine all the images that we on a personal level have a strong associations with based on our own lived experiences as well. Not to mention the fact that we're all on social media all the time now where we're looking at images and videos nonstop and then building new associations with images. So yeah, it's totally helpful to have archetypes and images of whatever to be brought into astrology as we're trying to like wade through our own associations and figure out what can be pulled from them.
Kate:
Yeah, yeah, I mean that really is wild to think about the amount of images your brain is taking in like on a daily basis and you know I would say it is true over history like your brain is just continually perceiving but I'm guessing that for most people throughout time in history there's a lot of habituated images where they wake up and they have their plow and they go to the plow and they plow the field and then they eat the dinner and it's the same dinner as yesterday. But we have so much novelty now and we're intaking an extraordinary amount of novel images if you just think like scrolling on social media. Now we've almost become habituated to novelty in a sense.
Jess:
With AI generated images too, like we have like things that we didn't even make that shouldn't even exist. I mean, I guess there's an argument there because they do exist and it is reality. So depending on what kind of views you have on fate, these AI images are real and were always going to exist and they bear their own like semblance of reality. But like, I mean, even that, I feel like we could sit there and take that apart for like days. But yeah, images are like, yeah. We're going through, it's like unprecedented times for sure of the image and how humans are gonna, yeah, take it different ways.
Kate: (28:14.702)
And I think that that's an interesting point with the artificially created images because it could be a climax of sorts of the way that we've already been artificially stimulating the mind with images and archetypally Saturn-Neptune's conjunction is coming to mind with this as well of Neptune being the image and then Saturn being what freezes the image in time. I see Neptune a lot in the charts of people who are photographers or videographers, filmmakers. So I always kind of associate Neptune with that. And then with the Saturn presence, you know, I don't think it's a stretch to say that we're gonna be forced to confront images very particularly in this time. And, you know, even as simply as photo evidence and video evidence and the way that they've been able to engineer videos now that are almost indistinguishable from actual footage. I have no idea how that's going to work out in the courts and different things like that.
Jess:
Totally. And I saw also like, so I saw this thing online, and whenever I'm like, ‘I saw this thing online’ I'm like, is it real? Who's to say.. but let's pretend that it’s real for a second.. where someone was like, ‘my grandma saw this post on Facebook and like thinks it's real, which is like so terrifying.’ And it was like a clearly AI generated video of Trump, like up on a stage dressed sort of like, he was wearing like a gold sparkly suit and was like playing guitar and playing this like beautiful song. And like, like he was almost giving like Elvis Presley or something like an Elvis Presley ballad. And like just this idea that that would make its way around Facebook and that like a much older generation would see that and be like, ‘wow, he's a beautiful songwriter as well. I love Trump’ And it's like, there's definitely a spectrum right now of like, how much a person and an individual will believe AI and find it believable and then how those people will choose to vote as well, really creates like.. there's like an entire demographic of people who may vote a particular way based on things that not only are untrue but are like blatantly untrue.
Kate:
Well, I actually saw something, and this could be total propaganda, millennial propaganda, but it was saying that the millennial generation are actually the most skeptical because anyone that was born a writer on the Uranus-Neptune conjunction and the invention of the internet... has a before and after of like, ‘this is life before the internet, this is life after the internet’. Whereas some of the subsequent generations, like Generation Z, it's been way more integrated into their experience. And then the previous generations, it's completely novel to them on a different level, like the Boomers and the Gen X. Millennials kind of are in this like unique space of like, I do like fully understand this technology and also like I'm fully skeptical of the technology as well.
Jess:
Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, that's actually like really eerie to think about Gen Z only knowing a world that has all of this technological capability. It felt really like exciting and novel to watch it come up. And it's not I mean, I was not very old when all like, I remember my mom having like dial up internet in her house when I was like seven in the late 90s, like mid to late 90s and being like what is like literally what is that? I'm not really sure what she's doing over there on that computer. Like, you know, what, and we would like play Oregon trail or whatever in elementary school. And that was it. was like, cool. So computers are for gaming and then for making really weird, loud noises and stopping me from using the phone. So like, I have this like pre-internet place in my mind, but it was only up until I think probably when I was around like, ten, was when everybody started having computers in their homes and having the internet and downloading music and stuff. But the idea that you're born and there’s social media is really jarring. But it feels like when I talk to Gen Z people about it that I know, so this is pretty anecdotal, but they don't feel... I mean, there's no way for them to feel the weight of it because it's their entire reality. They're like, I think it's good though. Like I like using social media. But at the same time, they'll tell me that like, they've been using Omegle since they were like nine and there were like old men grooming them on it. And I'm like, you don't think that it would be better to not have that?
Kate:
No, it is very integrated into their worldview and I think a lot of the psychological research is still developing with time on the effects on the brain and especially the way that age plays into that. I remember there being a popular study years ago where they quizzed Gen Z on would you rather cut off your arm or never have an Instagram again and they were like, arm. Cut off the arm. But what it was saying is, it sounds silly to like older generations, but the way that it's been so integrated into their sense of self and identity makes it feel far more crucial to them than you know, it would to your parents or like older generations of.. you know, this is like a very prominent social extension of yourself.
Jess:
Totally. And I think at the time, if you'd asked us in the mid-90s, would you rather have your arm cut off or no Nickelodeon or whatever, depending on your age, or no home phone, there's no way to call your girls after school or whatever, we might have said the same thing. And to us, that feels way more organic than social media. But to people that were older than us at that time, they're like, these fucking kids, they just want to be on the phone and watch TV. They're crazy. Also on the topic of social media.. So unless, is there more you wanted that we should touch on about like the next couple weeks of astrology?
Kate:
Yeah, I guess we've devolved from that, but yeah, that feels good.
Jess: (35:16.622)
Okay, so moving into other things going on in the world, I feel like I talked about Trump so much and I don't want to talk about him again for the rest of this episode. This is not a Trump or a political podcast. This is a cultural podcast. For events and stuff like that, I wrote down.. the first thing I made a bullet note of, and I am worried to spend too much time on this because I know not everybody watches it somehow, but Love Island was the first thing I wrote down. Uh, don't know if this is a, if this really speaks to like my mental unwellness, but I did write down the Sun and Moon sign of every single person on the cast of Love Island. And I had to research this. You can find their Sun signs really easily, but the Moon signs, I had to pull up their chart and write that down.
Kate:
This is the cutting edge astrology research that needs to be done.
Jess:
Yeah. And okay, so I didn't like analyze this data very closely, but I did notice while I was writing it down, like the like startling amount of, cast people that had the same Sun and Moon sign, like it was like weird, like it was, it felt like it was like at least a third of them had the same Sun and Moon sign. And maybe that's more common than I'm thinking it is, but like, I don't know. It felt like something. And also like the most notable one being Ace is his Leo Sun and Leo Moon. Yeah. The man who has his name tattooed twice on his own body.
Kate: (36:47.491)
Yeah that tracks. Wait, so are you saying that the cast members had within themselves the same Sun and Moon or relationally?
Jess:
Yes, yeah.
Kate:
Okay, so a lot of people born on new Moons.
Jess:
Yeah, yeah, like running some down real quick. So Jeremiah is a Taurus Sun and might also be a Taurus Moon. He was right on the, the Moon's on the cusp of Taurus or Gemini. So I don't know the time of birth for like a single one of these people, but he might have Taurus Sun and Taurus Moon. And then Taylor is, Taylor is a Gemini Sun and a Gemini Moon, which I thought was really interesting because he doesn't, at first I was like, this man does not strike me as a Gemini. He seems like way too like detached. And aloof and like not very affectionate with Olandria during the first like bunch of the season. But then I thought about it and I always have to remind myself like male Geminis present from what I can tell very differently from female Geminis. Like I feel like Gemini men are just like they do have that strong sense of detachment. They're like goofy but then when it comes to something like serious or affectionate or like anything that kind of leans towards like the feminine archetype they're just like… It's just like total silence.
Kate:
Yeah, which I think makes sense. And this is something that I think about with client practice too, of just the different ways that society has cultured certain archetypes to be.. That comes up with Cancer a lot, too. A lot of Cancer men are like, ‘I don't feel like a Cancer’. And I'm like, well, you've been told that you shouldn't be. So you're always working with societal expectations, even if that's like true to your archetypal nature.
Jess:
For sure, yeah. And like the societal expectation is that like men should not be involved in astrology. So it's like you're going to feel like you've, yeah, like the Cancer archetype is about filling traditional roles. And so a lot more Cancer women are going to feel like they're filling a traditional female role by taking an interest in the more emotional and the more unknown, whereas men are going to feel more traditional, kind of leaving that to the women, I guess. Did you watch the finale of Love Island by the way?
Kate:
Yes, I did watch the finale. I did not watch every episode of Love Island, unfortunately, but I did watch every TikTok made about Love Island, so...
Jess: (39:24.11)
Did you like Amaya and Brian, who won?
Kate:
I did, yeah, I was definitely Team Amaya, Amaya Papaya. I was on the bandwagon for her, for sure. To me, she struck me as very genuine and I couldn't have picked a better winner.
Jess:
I feel like all of my friends are mad at me because I just didn't like Amaya from the start. I liked her slightly more by the end, but I just was not into Amaya Papaya. One of my good friends, she's the one that got me into Love Island, I think she's actually bothered. I think that she thinks that there is something to be investigated about me because I don't like Amaya.
Kate:
Controversy. We should investigate it.
Jess: (40:10.666)
Yeah, like she thinks that there's something dark inside me. It's interesting you say that and we can, cause I feel like, I mean, we've known each other two months, but I feel like from what I can tell about it.. And also I forgot to say in the intro that you also did a reading for me after the fact. And it was like definitely the best astrology reading I've had from another astrologer. And, I really, trust your opinions on like.. I have yet to hear an opinion from you I don't pretty much wholeheartedly agree with. So this is like the first thing. And this is like a theme for me. Everyone loves Amaya and I just don't. So I think it is worth investigating and I’d love to do it with you.
Kate:
Yeah. Well, and I can play Libra. I can play Libra here too. You know, I could see the like, maybe you're not like fully buying the act with her. Does that feel true? Or what is it?
Jess:
Hearing you say that you think that she was like really authentic and genuine was like that was what I didn't like about her is I didn't think that she was. But with a caveat, I think that she like, my take on Amaya is that she is emotionally and intellectually like very underdeveloped. You know, we don't know anything about her history, her background. So like, this is definitely an assumption on my part and I wouldn't try to like speculate what could be in her past, but I feel like maybe Amaya, like, my guess about Amaya is she probably did not have a super easy upbringing or childhood, and it has left her emotionally stunted. I mean, I kind of think that a little bit about everyone on Love Island, but I especially feel that way about Amaya.
Kate: (41:57.358)
Probably a prerequisite to going on reality television and dating.
Jess:
Yeah, like, I do think like what I like about Amaya is I think she approaches people with like, genuine compassion. I think she comes in assuming that everyone is like a decent person and that she wants to give them understanding. And like, that's something I relate to. And I think it's like a really beautiful quality for her to have like she has really good positive energy. But I think that like, she communicates in such a childlike way and does not have any ability to like, explore deeper before she makes judgments or gets close with someone like she would like be telling people that she like.. like she told Brian he was like one of her best friends and they had known each other for like a week or something like that. That made me feel like I can't trust anything she's saying but I think she trusts, I don't think she's lying I think that she just like her view of reality is just really unhinged and that was why I didn't like her.
Kate: (42:54.37)
I think that's fair. I also think with what I've read about these reality television shows like this one and Love is Bind, or the ones that come to mind, but the cast members report feeling like extremely confused, like on like a soul level because the producers are playing this god-like role but they can't fully influence them. So they feel like they're being drawn into certain narratives or pushed or pulled in certain ways by these unseen forces. And then they're just totally cut off from any sense of actual reality. And it's almost like their view of time is warped or some of them have talked about their self-image being very warped while they're... And like, yeah, there's an argument I consistently have with my partner, specifically watching Love is Blind, where he's just like, ‘there's just no way that they have feelings for each other. It's been like a week, it's been two weeks’. And I'm like, ‘you clearly have never been fully delusional at any point in your life’. Because like, this does happen, like you can become extremely delusional. And I think that that's really what reality TV like thrives on is kind of that Neptunian of like, you know, we're gonna sleep deprive these people, we're gonna like control their diets and like make them drink a bunch of alcohol and like just see like what we can evoke out of them. Which all that to say, like, I would say when I'm watching, I'm like, very, I'm watching with this kind of lens of like, the producers playing God to this person and then like trying to understand like their background and why they're responding in the way that they are. And I totally agree with you of like, you know, what was going on with her in that way. And then like, also, I feel the same way about like the cast members as I do about the government of just like, who knows what these people are actually like, like there's the show, there's a show of the United States government. And then there's just like, the puppets, you know, and then there's people pulling the strings of the puppets and yeah, all that to say is it's a huge mess to me. But in terms of like analyzing her specifically, I think you're spot on.
Jess:
Thank you. Do you hear that, Caitlin? I'm going to make my friend Caitlin listen to this so I can be vindicated. So I totally agree too about like you've clearly never felt delusional. And I feel like that is why maybe reality TV especially appeals to women is because like I feel like most women out there know. I feel like a particularly like, psychologically masculine-leaning woman too, just in that like I tend to approach things from a more like, and I don't mean this in positive way, but a more like rational perspective. Like in my mind, things have to be proven to me before I believe them usually, which feels very male-brained. But even I like, I'm like, I have been fully delusional and it has made me fall in love with someone way sooner than I ever should have. And so women see that and they're like, this is crazy. And I relate. And yeah, about like the producers just completely controlling everything these people do, like when they wake up and what they eat and how they talk to each other, blah, blah, blah. Like that it’s like, I feel like people have said this online lot right that it's like is it the Stanford prison experiment? Yeah, like that it was basically like that except it looks like the Barbie movie.
Kate:
Yeah, wait, I love that.
Jess:
Yeah, for sure. And then it all, everything you said too feels very Saturn-Neptune. Like that the cast was going through this and us as viewers, like what here is real and what is curated? I mean, I almost feel like there's like a conspiracy about it where I'm like, did they actually use America's votes because when they split up Huda and Jeremiah at the beginning.. they were like, ‘America said you got like, Jeremiah is getting re-coupled up with Iris’. I was like, that like my first thought was just as like a male-brain person was I was like, yeah, production set this up for the dramatic effect because it’s crazy to do. And it also could speak to the like collective psyche where like America gets together to vote the most chaotic thing because they want to cause damage to see what goes on in this house. It's like an experiment for America to like do to these people.
Kate: (47:33.966)
Yeah, I mean, I'm not going to argue that that is what is happening in America right now. I mean, we literally did it on a political level as well.
Jess:
Oh yeah.
Kate:
If it's happening on Love Island, you know, it doesn't shock me.
Jess:
Love Island is just the currently most strong mirror of American politics.
Kate:
Someone could do a thesis on that for sure.
Jess:
Oh absolutely. Alright I'm going to scoot us along from Love Island so that we don't have to torment anyone listening who like doesn't give a shit about Love Island. Okay. We honestly are. Okay. Here's something that I'm hoping you can explain to me. So in like the few chats that Kate and I have had outside of this, it seems like you are a little more tuned in to like trends and stuff than I am. And I think that I'm like, not that far behind you. I think I'm just like a small step behind you at all times because I have a two and a half year old. Last night I put him to bed and I was so like, I was just ready to like end it all after fighting with him to get in his bed that I just like, I went into my room in complete darkness at like 8pm and I did not, I just went to sleep and I got up this morning at seven and was like, ‘wow. I just clocked like 11 hours of sleep because I was so mentally exhausted’. So if anything happened online last night, I missed it. And that drives me insane. One thing that has missed me entirely that I was hoping you could fill me in on, cause I've got a feeling you're going to know. Okay. And I'm going to feel so stupid saying this out loud. I wrote it down cause I would never remember what this is. Okay. okay. Dubai chocolate, Labubu, matcha. Please tell me why these three things individually matter and why they have come together.
Kate:
Okay, I actually had no idea that they came together, but I can speak to the three things individually. I mean, you've seen the Dubai chocolate that's having a moment?
Jess:
Like not really like I've seen it, I've seen these things mentioned sort of like ironically in memes and that is the extent of my knowledge. So it's real chocolate?
Kate:
These are all, these have all been lately objects of cultural worship for whatever reason. The Dubai chocolate was getting like kind of a lot of thirst trap type vids. It's like..
Jess:
Of chocolate?
Kate:
Yeah, I believe it's pistachio in the middle.
Jess:
Oh that sounds really good.
Kate:
Yeah, I like the other day I was like I saw some at, like a 7-Eleven and I was like, ‘wow, they have Dubai chocolate in the 7-Eleven?’
Jess:
So when did this start? Like how far behind am I in knowing what this stuff is?
Kate:
This has to be months. Like this has to be a long time with the Dubai chocolate.
Jess:
Oh my god. Okay, quick sidebar before you continue on Dubai chocolate. Kate is who convinced me to finally get TikTok. I downloaded TiKTok like one month ago. For the first time ever. I'd been holding out because I was worried I would get addicted to it. And I was just like already addicted to Instagram and Twitter and Reddit. I was like, I do not need a fourth social media addiction. And then Kate was like, we like we're connecting about how we both care so much about what's going on. And we like don't want to slip into like millennial dark ages and we like need to know what is happening. And so I was, and then she was like, yeah, you were like, ‘you need to get TikTok then’. And I was like, all right, that is the only case that could be made for me to download it. And so I did. And I think because of that, like I just was getting the trickle down, like the Instagram trickle down until a month ago, just like I was hearing about things like months after, or even sometimes like a week after something breaks feels like three months after. So. I shouldn't be shocked, but I am that you're telling me Dubai chocolate's been a trend for months now. Okay, go on.
Kate:
Yeah, sadly, I am a TikTok evangelist. But I just, you know, I see people who suffer from Facebook reel addiction. And I'm like, you know, let me give you something like some real good stuff. Let me put you onto TikTok. But yeah, anyway, Dubai chocolate. It looks good. I think it's getting attention for its looks.
Jess:
It just looks and tastes good and that's it? There's nothing else to it? Okay. So was this like an ad injection? Like did Dubai chocolate go out.. Also, is it a brand or a kind of chocolate?
Kate: (52:09.57)
I believe that it is a... originally it was a brand and then it became, like there's a lot of knockoffs of the Dubai chocolate like I want to say the actual Dubai chocolate originally was very expensive. But all of these like I mean it's just like one of the things that like the internet like decides that it loves and then it like then it also like drives the price up. Because this is something that happens with influencers a lot where it's just like a product will gain attention and then all of a sudden it's worth like $100 on Amazon. And I believe that was happening with Dubai Chocolate for a while.
Jess:
And now it’s at 7-Eleven.
Kate:
If it makes you feel any better, I almost picked up the chocolate bar at 7-Eleven to bring to a party and I mentioned it and they were like, that's so like eight news cycles ago, like we don't want your Dubai chocolate.
Jess: (53:14.584)
Uh-oh. Kate has left the chat. Alright, I'm gonna keep vamping until she comes back. I think her Wi-Fi disconnected. Alright, so to recap so far, I watched Love Island far too much. Kate, slightly less. Okay, she's back. Dubai chocolate. No, it's still loading.. Can't wait to hear how matcha factor's in. Alright. There's only so much vamping. My god, I'm getting PTSD from when I had this podcast by myself. Doing a podcast solo with not even a guest on the other mic is truly the stuff of nightmares. All right, so super, super Mercury retrograde activity happening over here with our podcasting app. We had to break and troubleshoot and now we are back and please, I am dying to know more about Dubai chocolate, Labubu and Matcha.
Kate:
Yeah, it's like classic astrologers not taking their own advice, starting a podcast during Mercury retrograde. But yeah, so basically all we were saying is that this is a creation of influencers and objects of cultural worship. First of the Dubai chocolate, and then the Labubu, which you you've seen Labubus, right?
Jess: (54:51.98)
All I know is like, all that I think I know is they're like little key chains that are like poofy animals, right?
Kate:
Like to me it's like, like remember when troll dolls were big?
Jess:
Yeah.
And everyone's like had to have their troll doll or like a beanie baby, but like horrifying. Like the Labubu is like horrific to me.
Jess: (55:12.386)
Wait, really? Okay, I'm Googling them right now. I haven't seen them up close.
Kate:
No, I mean, I'm sure like it's like a taste thing like they have their their own..
Jess:
Oh my god, the teeth! Do they all have those teeth?
Kate:
I just know my mom would never let me have something like that as a child.
Jess:
Oh my God, well then your mom is right because this is like, why are there, like, if you look at like a tiny image of it, I'm like, what would be so scary about this? And then I click on it and look at it bigger and I'm like, what the fuck?
Kate: (55:46.126)
Totally. No, I saw like a vending machine where you could do like the claw to get a Labubu. And my partner was like, I'm gonna do it. And I was like, I don't want that. Like I would not want you to win. I'm scared.
Jess:
You'd pay money to not get a Labubu.
Kate:
Yeah, exactly. So that's Labubu.
Jess:
At least they're wearing clothes like they'd be worse if they were naked like trolls. So they have that one thing going for them.
Kate:
Well, and they are exorbitantly expensive. Like that is the interesting thing about Labubus. It's like they are insanely expensive. Hundreds of dollars.
Jess:
What?
Kate:
Yeah.
Jess: (56:23.722)
Is that because social media like jacked up the price? Or did they just come in..
Kate:
Yes.
Jess:
Okay. How much were they originally?
Kate:
I don't know what they were originally or how much it influenced it, but they are like a premiere luxury good at this point.
Jess:
What the f.. Looking at it for the first time just now I would have been like seven dollars. That item is worth seven dollars.
Kate:
No that's the tax. That's the tax on your Labubu.
Jess:
Oh my god.
Kate: (56:56.207)
Yeah, and then Matcha. Matcha is also having this huge cultural moment, which it's like, okay, obviously, Matcha has been around forever.
Jess:
Yeah, I thought that was like a millennial trend.
Kate:
Yes. But now it's been completely revamped because like matcha is now for everybody like there was a specific demographic that was like, you know white blonde girl Pilates matcha like aesthetic but now matcha like there was like some videos that went viral of like, it was like black boy joy matcha like just kind of like bringing matcha ironically to the people. And so now matcha is like, you know, having this kind of influence over like, the entire internet as being this kind of, like, ironically, healthy but not healthy thing. And so I'm guessing that the, let's put this together.. the Dubai chocolate Labubu matcha is some sort of horrifying matcha creation that has like both the Dubai chocolate in it and then some sort of like insane looking chocolate Labubu.
Jess: (58:21.39)
Okay-
Kate:
And I am scared. I'm scared to look at them.
Jess:
It feels like toilsome like it feels like everyone is just like experiencing social media fatigue, but also like addiction and everyone's just like scrambling to make sure we don't run out of shit to do on there and they're just like ‘uh, okay. We're gonna take Dubai chocolate matcha and Labubu and we're gonna put them all together, okay?’ Like ‘come on. We gotta keep going. Just go with it, just go with it.’
Kate:
Yeah, one of my favorite things on the internet is when someone will comment like the hours of screen time required to understand this meme because it really reveals the depths of the internet and the layers that go into some of like the more intricate memes.
Jess:
Yeah. Okay, here's actually then one more that I would love for you to explain to me. It's... I feel like you're gonna be able to fill in the blank for me. I don't know why I can't remember now, but it's like Natalie Portman and then some kind of like, food item. Do you know what I'm talking about?
Kate:
No, I'm behind on this.
Jess:
Oh my god, Natalie Portman. Okay, I'm googling it. Oh yeah, it's ‘Natalie Portman McRib’. Okay, this one actually seems to be relatively new. Oh my god, of course, dude, you always think a meme situation is new until you look it up on Know Your Meme and it's like ‘origin: On August 11th, 2022…”
Kate:
Literally, or it's like 2014 and you're like, okay, must be Mercury retrograde.
Jess:
Okay. So this is the format. It's very easy to understand. It is one image and half of the image is a picture of Natalie Portman smiling and the other half is like a promo image of the McRib. That's it. And people just keep posting it everywhere. And I'm like, what? So this is what it is. It has a very weird and short origin. In 2022, an X user made a post sharing several graphics that compare the ages of specific actors to the age of certain food items. The first image compares Natalie Portman to the McRib claiming they are both 41 years old. And then in July, 2025, July 12th, so this was only 12 or yeah, 10 days ago, a user posted a moldy version of the Natalie Portman McRib image as a new profile pic post, gathering over 24,000 likes and 1,600 reposts in two days. Yeah, it's as simple as that, and now, the next day it started spreading with an even moldier version of the meme in response. It's just like a really blurred version of the same image. And for some reason, everyone is sharing this. Again, I will say, I think people are just trying to find shit. It's funny that memes get brought back and that matcha is getting brought back because it's the same thing with movies, with politicians… We're just taking shit and doing it again. Like literally nothing new is happening in any cultural corner and it's driving me insane
Kate:
Well yeah, I mean, I think that that is like the very basic premise of meme culture is that everything is just like a different iteration of another thing. There was like this like political theory course that I took about like memetic theory and like, basically saying that in postmodernism, meme culture is just the social version of something that's also happening at every level of culture. Everything's just become a meme of a thing. Our government’s become a meme of government. I'm not going to say there's a lack of creativity, but it's just a different form of creativity.
Jess:
Totally. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm probably not being- I know.
Kate:
Also McRibs have like always been funny. Like I do not remember a time in my life that like there wasn't some hype around the McRib.
Jess:
It's true, like every time it comes back, everybody acts like it's like the second time the McRib has ever come back, but it comes back every like two years, right?
Kate: (01:02:34.006)
We need to pull the chart of the McRib.
Jess:
I like I grew up eating McDonald's like I still I love it. I eat it.. I'm gonna be honest. I eat McDonald's once a week like me and my friends get together and we get McDonald's once a week and I told myself when I had a kid one day that they wouldn't grow up with the same issue of eating McDonald's and yet here I am as a mom and I'm like, ‘here's your happy meal, sweetie, have a blast!’ But in all of the years I grew up with it I had not heard of the McRib somehow until I was like 18 or 19. I don't know how that missed me. And I was driving by it with my friends, like past a sign, like a McDonald's sign, and it had like, it was like, ‘the McRib is back’. You know, like they always have that on their sign. But for some reason the M and then the C-R-I-B were like really far apart. And so we drove by and I had like never heard of it. And I was like, what is an M-Crib? And they like, did not let that go for like seven years. It just like followed me. I had just like a full Saturn cycle of like my M-crib shame coming back to get me.
Kate: (01:03:41.902)
I can't believe you went multiple Saturn cycles without knowing about the McRib. Like a late bloomer.
Jess:
I know, but then the snack wraps just came back and that, I feel like I was like, I had them once when they were around and I didn't understand, like I thought it was good, but I did not understand how obsessed everybody was with snack wraps until like they came back just now this summer.
Kate:
And now you're on board with Snack Wraps.
Jess:
I mean, I had one. was like, sure. That was a nice change of pace. Now I'm going to go back to getting a Big Mac next week, like I have done for all time. All right. Anyway, I feel good about where we are at, which I think we did like over an hour here. And I'm impressed and also not surprised because I feel like we get together and this is what we do. We could have gone for another hour right now if we wanted to, I'm sure.
Kate: (01:04:36.408)
Totally.
Jess:
Well thanks for shooting the shit with me. Thanks for hopping on the pod. I'm really excited to keep doing this with you. I think we're going to have so much fun. I hope that this was enjoyable for anyone out there.
Kate:
Yeah, thank you all for listening to this and following the wandering path of archetypal astrology to McRibs.
Jess:
Yeah. Oh my gosh. Yeah. We're going to need to come up with a little like sign-off thing too. I think like when I had the first part, when I first did the podcast and it was comedic for Astro Blast, our sign off was.. a lot of my co-host’s jokes, Chris, were very like, horny, and the sign off was, I think it was like, ‘H for the D’. I think it was just that. And then when I did it by myself, I feel like I said, ‘explore the dark’, which is like.. I think that's what it was, which is sort of like the slogan I use for Inkblot astrology. So yeah, we'll have to think on this. I'm afraid to even use anything like any quotable meme conversation we've had because it will sound so dusty by two weeks from now.
Kate (01:05:47.864)
What's coming to mind is I think it's Kourtney Kardashian. Are you familiar with ‘abcdefg I have to go’?
Jess:
No.
Kate:
Abcdefg I have to go.
Jess:
Is that.. happening now? Or is this like..
Kate: (01:06:05.898)
It's perennial, I would say. It's evergreen at this point.
Jess:
Okay, okay, it's A, B, C, D, E, F, G, H, I have to go?
Kate:
No, there's no H.
Jess:
There's no H?? Is that why it's perennial? Because there is no- like that's what made it a meme is because there's no H?
Kate:
I think so, yeah. It must be the missing H.
Jess:
Am I totally killing the humor of it by analyzing it right now?
Kate:
No, I think that's what we're here to do.
Jess:
Okay good, alright well let's try it, alright. Alright, this is gonna be great on a two second delay.
Kate:
Right?
Jess:
Alright, ready?
Kate: (01:06:45.929)
..set?
Kate and Jess: (01:06:55.486)
A, B, C, D, E, F, G, F, F, F, G, G, G, G, F, I have to go.
Kate:
Close enough for Mercury Retrograde.
Jess: (01:07:03.118)
Okay good. Alright, have a safe Mercury retrograde, everyone.
